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Testing - v1.8.2 - Title Bar Path Format (Minor)

When testing v1.8.2 I saw that the title bar now contains path information regarding the notebook and note being viewed.

2021-04-25 16_42_05-Window

In my case (above) the test notebook is called "Secondary" and the test note is called "Text Note - 06"

The title bar shows Secondary > Text Note - 06 - Joplin. "- Joplin" has been appended to the path which makes it look like the note title (and every other note title) contains the word "Joplin".

A very minor point I know, but if "Joplin" is to be displayed in the title bar would it not be more logical if the title bar showed:

Joplin > Notebook > Note
e.g. Joplin > Secondary > Text Note - 06

with "Joplin" appearing as the "root" of the path immediately after the app icon?

Edit: Also it seems that the title bar path cannot manage sub-notebooks, so Notebook > Subnotebook > Note only shows as Subnotebook > Note.

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Indeed maybe "Joplin" shouldn't displayed at all then, since the icon is sufficient for this.

I don't expect we'll support nested sub-notebooks as that could make too long titles.

I like the fact that I see Joplin (DEV) in the title bar, when I am working on the dev version.

However, I understand that the format is lacking:
Note title - Joplin or Note title - Joplin (DEV) is not the most legible format.

I've been thinking about how to improve it without losing the indicator that I'm running a dev version. Unfortunately I haven't found a great solution yet.

Possibly, but isn't it better to keep the product name visible unless you there's a good reason to remove it? The idea of "Joplin" being the source of all the notes works for me... :slight_smile: and I guess it could show "Joplin" or "Joplin (DEV)" > Notebook > Note?

True the path could possibly get quite long but doesn't omitting higher level notebooks undermine the very purpose of the feature? If you only use first level notebooks then having the path displayed doesn't seem to really add anything.

Call me cynical but after loitering around this forum for a couple of years my spidey-sense tells me that if this feature is rolled out in a main release and does not show a "full path" it will quickly be reported as a bug or suggested as a feature request !!!

Anyway, point raised, time to move on...

Yes, unfortunately using > in this case is too ambiguous. People could think it's a folder.

The problem is that all separation characters can be used in a note title. But I'd rather go with one of these:

Joplin | notebook > note
Joplin :: notebook > note

I think having Joplin (\(DEV\))? in the front is better than at the end.

2 Likes

I don't have a strong opinion about all this so I'm thinking we wait to see what feedback we get. If it turns out most users indeed expect to have the full notebook path in the title bar then it's easy enough to add it. And in any case we also always preserve the (DEV) part.

I'd say the correct hierarchy would be:
Note title – Notebook title – Joplin
But... I don't see the added benefit of adding the notebook to the app title.

  1. It breaks with conventions (both the formatting and the separator). Apps like OneNote, Evernote, vsCode, you name it, all use the format: <note or filename> – <app name> Note, the is an en-dash.

  2. It clutters up the interface with info that is right there in front of you in the UI. You could say the same for the note's title, but one could have more Joplin windows open at the same time.

Having that said, I'd go for something as simple as:
Note title – Joplin

Hmm, yes I'm wondering about the notebook title too, is that something we really need? I look at it and it always take me a while to see what's the notebook title and what's the note title in there.

Since the notebook is already displayed inAll notes and when you browse the search results, it may be better to display this also when you are in a notebook and then remove it from the title.
grafik

grafik

Maybe the notebook should be shown before the tags?
grafik

Could be, although I feel that would be a new feature.

What I'm wondering is when is it useful to display the note title in the title bar? Because it's already displayed prominently at the top of the app. The notebook title might be a little more useful if the sidebar is not scrolled at the right place, but not indispensable either.

In fact I think we've rushed to add this without any good rational behind it.

Ok, I'm a bit confused now. What would be the benefit of adding just the note title to the title bar? (1)

It does not appear to tell the user anything they cannot already see (2 & 3) and cannot hide (3).

Scrolling a note, even when editing, rolls the note body under the title / editor bar, so it is always visible

However a benefit of including the full path would be that if you are viewing or editing a note with both the notebook and note sidebars collapsed you would be able to see where the note you are editing is actually located.

This means that if you have notes with the same title in more than one notebook you could easily determine what one you are actually editing / viewing without activating the sidebars again.

Just suggesting that this way the change would possibly add to Joplin rather than just replicate information already visible.

Ok, I'm a bit confused now. What would be the benefit of adding just the note title to the title bar? (1)

It does not appear to tell the user anything they cannot already see (2 & 3) and cannot hide (3).

It's true the note title is the less useful part in there, because it's at least always visible in (3). Perhaps we should get rid of the note title and only leave the notebook titles then?

Why not look at what the Windows & macOS guidelines say about the window shell?:

We recommend that you set a title that describes the window, not the app.

Use the display name when using a file name as a window title.
[…]
Don’t display file or folder paths in the title bar. Paths are generally too long to fit in the title bar without clipping, and they’re difficult to parse at a glance. Show the filename in the title bar instead. If you want to expose the complete path, do so in another way, such as through an inspector pane.

https://developer.apple.com/design/human-interface-guidelines/macos/windows-and-views/window-anatomy#the-window-frame

@dpoulton Why just show the note title? One could (theoretically) have multiple instances of Joplin open at the same time. On Windows you see which note is open in the task bar.

Why not also show the notebook hierarchy in the title?:

If you want to expose the complete path, do so in another way, such as through an inspector pane.”

This is what the sidebar is for. If you decide to collapse the sidebar collapsed you indeed loose some information.

I think we should decide carefully. There are a lot of users with different ways of using Joplin. App design is making best decision for the majority of them. For this, I haven't come across any arguments that justify to differ from the norm of <note name> – <app name>.

One benefit of having note title in window header is that you can see it on the task bar. Here's Joplin next to VSCode for comparison:

image

As I initially said I saw this as a minor thing so I am not investing in any particular approach and will accept whatever is rolled out. I did not expect this sort of engagement with the post :slight_smile: .

After looking at several other programs I could see that a common format is Filename - Application. With - looking as if it is an em or en-dash.

I just wondered if implementing a path-based approach similar to NoteTab (admittedly a bit of an old program now) or Notepad++ (who seem to have also deviated from the norm) would add a bit of useful info for the user.

notetabpro
App - Path \ File

notepadplusplus#
Path \ File - App

Just want to mention that VSCode actually let's the user decide, see my post in the previous discussion.

To me, the general question is: "When do people look at the window title?"

Personally, I only "see" the window title in a taskbar or when Alt + Tabbing between different windows. I.e. when trying to change to some window that is not currently visible on screen. In this view, the window title is always truncated in some way, so displaying just the note title as first information would make most sense.

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For now I have reverted this change as I realise it's not clear what should be implemented and what problem is being solved. If someone is interested in this change, ideally I would need a short spec that describes:

  • Why this change needs to be added, what problem is being solved
  • What should be the format of the title bar (notebook? sub-notebook? note title? application name?)

Once this is agreed we can put back the feature.

Revert commit: Revert "Desktop: Resolve #3695: Show notebook and note title in the t… · laurent22/joplin@a0ead2c · GitHub

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