Interesting. Well, the last Windows I used was Windows 3.1... 
No. The client on 2.2 will sync. The client 2.3+ will be in the mode "I cannot sync until the sync target is upgraded". You can use Joplin, but sync won't work until you click the link in the warning section.
Sure it's ok. Whatever helps to make it more understandable is certainly welcome.
Not sure I follow. If you upgrade to a sync target that is newer than the old app can understand, of course they (the old apps not using the new sync format) won't be able to sync.
Absolutely, it's perfectly clear to me now. 
Don't worry, you've already answered that edit, it was refering to this, communication is hard over forums sometimes 
Thank you, I'm as clear as I need to be. If I had realized this was talking about a pre-release I would have ignored it completely.
I had no idea regular users are running these pre release versions. I'm even scared to install the actual release for fear of loosing my data. 
Thats why I was wondering if the pre release versions couldn't have some indication that thats what they were.
Anyway, I have so much gratitude for everyone's hard work.
By the way, any suggestions on a release strategy for this sync target upgrade? There will be a pre-release as usual, but the vast majority of users will only discover the change when they upgrade, and maybe they will hit some edge cases.
So besides Tessus's post anything else we can do to make the transition as smooth as possible?
The problem is that people often dismiss warnings without knowing the consequences.
I hope that this post will shed some light on this.
Unfortunately I doubt there's much else that can be done. Unless we create a modal dialog that has a detailed description, which in itself is a rather questionable approach.
But who knows, maybe someone comes up with a brilliant plan...
I think it's just a matter of as far as reasonably possible, co-ordinating the release so all 2.3 clients are marked stable at the same time.
I don't know how mobile works with staged rollouts, but given the review process Apple in particular has, if it's possible to submit the release but stall releasing it until everything is ready, try aim for that.
Even with automatic updates on the snap that should check every 6 hours and update once daily, the roll-out metrics end up looking like this (each colour being a new Joplin version's adoption over time)
So realistically I think if even auto-update is struggling to get everyone within a reasonable timescale, it's an unsolvable problem, so there'll be people asking regardless but you can at least minimise noise in the first few days/hours.
I don't know how mobile works with staged rollouts, but given the review process Apple in particular has, if it's possible to submit the release but stall releasing it until everything is ready, try aim for that.
Good point, I assume it's possible so I'll check that. It means I'll upload the iOS app first, then once Apple approves it, I'll release the Android app (Google is much faster although they took about 24 hours recently). Once that's in the store, I release the iOS app, then desktop and CLI, which can be available immediately.
I'm not too worried about the auto-update schedule because if a client is out-dated there's still a message that show up to ask to upgrade, so as long as the new version is available it should be fine.
I have been a software developer for 30 years and still the implication of the cryptic "sync target" warning message made no sense to me. Now I have two desktop pre-release versions that work fine together but my fully updated release edition Android app can no longer access my new notes.
So what is the timeline for when my normal Android app will work again, or do I have to install and run a pre-release (manual with dl'ed apk I assume)?
This update was botched, gentlemen. I hope nothing like this happens in the future, because it will severely undermine trust in the product.
Do you mind me asking how you updated? The following warning should have been displayed for most updates (I don't think the linux update script shows this).
IMPORTANT: This release will ask you to upgrade your sync target. Once it is done, only apps version 2.3+ will be able to sync with it. So far the Android and Desktop app 2.3 are available as pre-releases, but iOS and CLI apps are not. So if you are frequently using these two apps, wait for them to be available before installing this release. See the release post for more information.
It does use the cryptic phrase "sync target", but otherwise this feels fairly clear that only updated applications will be able to sync.
It does appear that the android pre-release is not quite available which is regrettable. It should be available shortly.
Perhaps you could lend some of your considerable experience to this project for the next release?
When a user opens Joplin, they have a specific task they are intending to do right there and then. Typically it is to quickly write down a note before they forget it. This may happen in the morning pre-caffeine, it may happen when the boss or the spouse is on the phone and a thousand important things happen around them.
Presenting the user at that point with a flashy "important" message embedded in a screen size popup box with a wall of text that requires the user to make complex decisions about upgrade paths is horribly bad usability.
If you have not learned this by now, there is not much hope. Please leave future design decisions that affect actual end users to others.
Thanks for your input. I have been following this thread.
I have not tried this version yet. To upgrade the sync target will it just be a case of agreeing to the upgrade or is there more to the procedure.
I have only been using Joplin for 2 weeks but I am really impressed with it.
Thanks to all concerned.
Keith
Yes, the upgrade will happen automatically when Joplin updates. This entire process should be invisible to you. The only times it won't be are if you use the pre-release version (suspect you don't). Or if you update Joplin on one system, but not all of them. In that case, Joplin will prompt you to download and install the update.
Are you serious right now? As a software developer for 30 years you should have learned to read the release notes, especially when you don't understand a rather clear message.
@laurent I knew it. there are always people who ignore warnings even when they hit them in the face.
I am very sorry but this really makes me angry.
Tessus, what planet do you live on? Have you met other human beings? Nobody ever reads a wall of text in a popup note. Absolutely nobody. If you don't understand that you need to get out and meet people, and you should stay away from usability. And, yeah, don't break stuff.
Let me guess, Tessus, the other place you put important messages everybody has to read is in EULA, right?
PS: Did you read the release notes to the last version of Google Chrome (or whatever browser you use) before you upgraded? Be honest. Right. Nobody reads these things.
I live in the 21st century on planet Earth.
I don't use Chrome and for the SW I upgrade I do read the release notes. And no, I am not the one who writes EULAs, but I read them for the very few services I do use.
I don't use any public cloud systems, no home automation that is cloud based, or any other service which I don't have control over. There's one exception: I do have a gmail address which only forwards emails, thus I don't even log into Google webmail. If I do every 5 years or so, I use VPN and Tor.
And yes, most of my friends are ignorant fools when it comes to privacy. They don't care, because they don't have anything to hide argument and so. Not my problem. They have my email or phone number, but they won't find me on Google, Instagram, iCloud, WhatsApp, FB, or whatever they think is awesome.
So yes, I meet up with people in person and not on a freaking platform.
Either way, I think I am done here. There's no ground for discussion when common sense is thrown out the window. I can only say this was exactly the reasone why I started this topic in the first place.
The arguement of usability falls flat because the reason the sync-target upgrade is happening is primarily around usability regarding the E2E encryption functionality. Usability concerns which result in people making mistakes frequently to the point of causing data loss. A single pop-up window with some minor downtime once is absolutely worth the benefits gained from fixing problems long term.
Sacrificing long term usability benefits to avoid being annoying once would be insane.
If this was a case of the updates were marked stable and the rollouts were staggered I could understand, but this was already mentioned above. You've gone out of your way to cause this problem by choosing pre-releases.
Ok, again, if you had read the release notes, but clearly that's beneath you, you would know that the Android app is available and has been so for several days.
By the way your posts have been flagged several times. We won't delete them or block you but I'll ask you to please tone down the aggressive tone. People are volunteers here, doing their best to improve the app and provide support, they don't owe you anything.
