Is Slow Synchronization in Joplin a Manipulation or a Necessity?

Medullitus · 2024-04-15T17:32:28.045Z

KC_20CY:

Following my previous post, if I have to bet right now, I will bet against "Necessity", however, I think there is still some philosophical space that need be paid attention to, in terms of Manipulation.

Manipulation means intentionally steering. I can't believe that our developers are aware of the slow synchronization issue but deliberately choose not to solve it.

Medullitus · 2024-04-15T17:34:03.658Z

LeoW:

I have no idea how Joplin Cloud handles throughput and throttling. After hearing input from everybody I'm pretty sure that services like Google and Microsoft throttle your transactions especially when you're sending and receiving lots of tiny files.

I have a mega S3 account and it flies for transferring data.

I'm going to set up that service as hosting for a test Joplin and comparison.

I tried synchronizing with S3 and used Backblaze for that. It wasn't any different from using OneDrive or Syncthing.

LeoW · 2024-04-15T17:37:20.704Z

I consider myself to be a high-end expense user when it comes to operating systems and android. I have multiple Android devices and tablets and regularly install third-party software that I trust and scan with any virus software before I load it.

What is the purpose of this backup software in this scenario anyway?

In a few days I am planning to turn my Windows computer into a webdav server using rclone, and then configure my cell phone for webdev synchronization and give it to URL of my PC and see how well that works for synchronization.

Medullitus · 2024-04-15T17:39:39.003Z

LeoW:

I consider myself to be a high-end expense user when it comes to operating systems and android. I have multiple Android devices and tablets and regularly install third-party software that I trust and scan with any virus software before I load it.

What is the purpose of this backup software in this scenario anyway?

In a few days I am planning to turn my Windows computer into a webdav server using rclone, and then configure my cell phone for webdev synchronization and give it to URL of my PC and see how well that works for synchronization.

Titanium Backup is an old but well-known program. It is used to back up an application on your phone along with its data folder, and it uses root access to do this. When you restore the application again, it is ready to use with all files as if you had never deleted it. I think this could work for Joplin as well.

LeoW · 2024-04-15T17:49:24.452Z

Synchronizing the Joplin data to a PC or a server or a Cloud Drive is simple and does not require root access.

I backup my phone log and text messaging every night at 2:00 a.m. using a program called folder sync that copies the data to a cloud drive.

When I have the time to set up Joplin to sync to the local file system on Android and on my PC I will be using a few different synchronization apps as a comparison to see which one works the best when synchronizing data directly between my phone and my computer. The issue is I have three computers and a phone and a tablet that all need to be synced and going to OneDrive is a piece of cake for all of them. Going to peer would be a little bit of a pain but I'm going to try it so that I can provide valuable data perhaps for others that may want to go that route.

I run across people on forums that simply don't want their data in the cloud and this is what I am going to test at the end of the week.

Medullitus · 2024-04-15T17:51:53.409Z

Leow,

You're not understanding me. I'm not talking about the synchronization loop. I'm talking about refreshing Joplin with the data files as they are.

KC_20CY · 2024-04-15T17:52:40.126Z

Medullitus:

KC_20CY:

Following my previous post, if I have to bet right now, I will bet against "Necessity", however, I think there is still some philosophical space that need be paid attention to, in terms of Manipulation.

Manipulation means intentionally steering. I can't believe that our developers are aware of the slow synchronization issue but deliberately choose not to solve it.

Well, people sometime don't get to say whatever they want to say, below is an example and I quote:

News source:
The 'good luck' snack that makes Taiwan's technology behave - BBC News

The company says it hasn’t promoted the tech-protecting properties of its product. “The story grew and developed organically,

Extended quote:

We believe there is plenty of ambiguity between what is believable and what isn’t – Ting Jen-Chieh

LeoW · 2024-04-15T18:01:00.920Z

Refreshing them as they are. Hmm.

I guess I really don't understand.

One thing I have read from a lot of people is that when they lose it from Evernote to Joplin and have many gigabytes of data and many notebooks the initial synchronization can take a really long time.

Using local file system sync I am going to take my entire Joplin database on Windows and put it on a portable SST and then copy it into a folder on my Android and see if it recognizes everything probably all at once without having to synchronize thousands of files one at a time. I may zip everything into one file.

Then use as I mentioned earlier a few different programs that I will test to see if I can figure out if there is an option that's better than others.

I don't know how many people post their data on OneDrive for example but as I do I in addition regularly back up the Joplin database folder that is on OneDrive to another Cloud drive just to be on the safe side.

I have a small Google Drive and a small Microsoft Drive and a larger pea Cloud Drive and I use rclone to synchronize the data from Google and Microsoft to be Cloud so I have a backup of each of those on a different platform.

I'm also anxious to see if pcloud throttles the data like Microsoft and google.

dpoulton · 2024-04-15T18:39:22.948Z

LeoW:

I'm also anxious to see if pcloud throttles the data like Microsoft and google.

Unless there has been a recent change Joplin will not allow connections to pCloud. It is an unsupported WebDav provider because many users had problems with its reliability.

LeoW · 2024-04-15T18:57:26.404Z

Not a problem. I have a workaround.

First, I am going to set Joplin to synchronize with the local file system so that it creates a simple database folder on my PC and on my phone. Then I am going to use a third party synchronization program called rclone to sync the data from each device to pcloud.

I won't know if this solution will work until I try it however the concept is sound.

I won't be using webdav to pcloud.

andbenn · 2024-04-15T20:43:20.784Z

This will work.

Joplin Computer A - File System Sync that gets copied/moved to Device B with Joplin that does a File System Sync from the copied directory will work.

I had been using Syncthing to keep three devices up to date off of separate File System Sync directories, but migrated to webdav as I had some storage with a provider. Thus no need to have a second local copy (the File System Sync output/input), although backup-wise, not a horrible idea.

LeoW · 2024-04-15T21:12:40.177Z

Personally my preference is to store my main data store for synchronizing in the cloud somewhere whether it be at Joplin or Microsoft or elsewhere. I don't want it at home where I live in a hurricane Zone and I could be evacuated in a hurricane and not have access to my home computer.

I use rclone once a week to synchronize the file database for Joplin at Microsoft to a file directory on my pcloud drive so I have two copies of the primary database that each of my PCS and tablets and phones sync with.

For fun and to assist with others on the Forum that really don't want to use a cloud store. They want to do it between their Hardware PC phone Etc, much of the testing that I'm doing is for the benefit of folks that want to do. Synchronization between their own devices and not the cloud.

I'm going to turn one of my computers into a webdav server.
Then I'm going to configure my Chromebook and my second Windows computer my tablet and my phone to synchronize using webdav to the "server".

I'm very curious to see how well it works and if it works.

andbenn · 2024-04-15T23:11:43.709Z

I live between two active earthquake faults, so disaster recovery plans are always up front for me. At least 3 copies, on 2 different media, and 1 in a different time zone.

Yes agree, many don't want their data going out into the cloud. Syncthing is peer to peer. Joplin supports encryption to stop snoopers in between or if that remote datastore is compromised.

Either way, File System Sync to someplace then carrying that output to another place and File System Sync it in works like a champ, and you won't have any problems. The only caveat is conflicts on notes edited in both places between File System Sync actions.

This person on reddit took a File System Sync solution to webdav. Might help you. Reddit - Dive into anything

Medullitus · 2024-04-16T09:24:06.469Z

Update: The topic I opened has surpassed 1k views! I want to thank everyone who supported this topic! Our doors are open to all users who want to write messages and express their opinions! It's in our hands to protect Joplin as free and open-source software together!

KC_20CY · 2024-04-16T09:46:06.362Z

Medullitus:

Update: The topic I opened has surpassed 1k views! I want to thank everyone who supported this topic! Our doors are open to all users who want to write messages and express their opinions! It's in our hands to protect Joplin as free and open-source software together!

Your encouragement met my disappointment at a very interesting timing.

Medullitus · 2024-04-16T10:39:35.387Z

KC_20CY:

Medullitus:

Update: The topic I opened has surpassed 1k views! I want to thank everyone who supported this topic! Our doors are open to all users who want to write messages and express their opinions! It's in our hands to protect Joplin as free and open-source software together!

Your encouragement met my disappointment at a very interesting timing.

Don't forget that you can also open the issues you're experiencing on GitHub.

Holzk · 2024-04-16T10:56:51.530Z

You seem to be trying to make yourself look like a guardian of the value of free and open source software, but you cannot change the very fact that you had accused the developer based on the sheer speculation of deliberately not fixing the slow synchronization issue to sell Joplin Cloud, calling the developer a manipulator: Is Slow Synchronization in Joplin a Manipulation or a Necessity? - #81 by Medullitus - Support - Joplin Forum

Medullitus · 2024-04-16T11:05:14.783Z

Holzk:

You seem to be trying to make yourself look like a guardian of the value of free and open source software, but you cannot change the very fact that you had accused the developer based on the sheer speculation of deliberately not fixing the slow synchronization issue to sell Joplin Cloud, calling the developer a manipulator: Is Slow Synchronization in Joplin a Manipulation or a Necessity? - #81 by Medullitus - Support - Joplin Forum

I'm tired of repeating the same explanation to you over and over again. It seems clear that you're not willing to be convinced. The user post below accuses our developer @laurent of lying and censorship, along with reasons. If you're sincere, go ahead and respond to him too!

Android (background) sync interval Support

Ah well. It doesn't matter. They just don't want to implement it and they try to avoid this topic completely so it's unlikely that it will have background support like literally every other app. Being slow is one thing and it wouldn't matter if there would be background sync. The background sync is also necessary so that your mobile device is getting changes quickly when you change something on another client. Otherwise you might change the same note and you'll automatically run into a confl…

laurent · 2024-04-16T13:19:34.883Z

Since you're pinging me (and borderline insulting me) for the nth time...

@Medullitus, your posts have been flagged four times as inappropriate (and once as off-topic) and you've also been warned at least in two occasions in the forum about your behaviour.

Recently I didn't say anything because frankly I thought you'd get bored and move on with your life, but clearly that's not going to happen. The fact that you're targeting me specifically means I didn't want to get involved since I'm not the most neutral person to deal with you, not to mention I'm more interested in discussing facts and ideas than paranoid thoughts. However I feel your posts are starting to disturb this forum, and I also no longer want to come here every day and see your daily accusations and insults.

Because of all this, you've now been suspended for 30 days. After that you're free to participate in the forum again, however any behaviour like what's listed below will result in a permanent ban:

Personal attacks against other community members
Bumping multiple posts to push your opinion
Taking over other people posts to complain about barely related issues
Conspiracy theories about the project

And if you don't like this, well the internet is big and there are plenty of other places you go can to complain about how life is unfair and how people don't give you enough free stuff.

laurent · 2024-04-16T13:20:49.896Z